Season 9, Episode 2

Standards are the 'what' and curriculum is the 'how,' with Sue Pimentel

In this episode, Susan Lambert welcomes back Sue Pimentel to discuss the history and impact of the Common Core Standards on English Language Arts (ELA) and Literacy in the United States. Susan and Sue revisit what the standards were designed to focus on: knowledge building, college and career readiness, and fluency in both literary and informational texts. Their conversation covers the importance of text complexity, the lack of a research base to support leveled readers, knowledge building as a matter of equity, and content as a matter of access. While acknowledging the value of these standards, the discussion also highlights their limitations. Sue underscores the importance of always returning to the research to ensure students are truly learning, being prepared to navigate the world, and ultimately, to live happier lives.

Meet our guest(s):

Susan Pimentel

Susan Pimentel is a founding partner of two nonprofits devoted to accelerating student achievement, StandardsWork and Student Achievement Partners. For four decades her work has focused on advancing meaningful and enduring education reforms—characterized by stakeholder buy-in—that champion proven tools for increasing academic rigor and student preparation. She has served as lead writer of the Common Core State Standards for English Language Arts and Literacy and chief architect of the American Diploma Project, two initiatives designed to close the gap between high school and postsecondary demands. In addition, Susan served two terms on the National Assessment Governing Board, an independent, bipartisan board that sets policy for the national assessment. She became vice-chair of the body in her second term. One of her most widely-read publications includes a 2018 EducationWeek op-ed “Why Doesn’t Every Teacher Know the Research on Reading Instruction?” Others include “Reading as Liberation: An Examination of the Research Base” and “Scaling the “Dinosaur Effect”: Topic vs. Theme in Elementary Classrooms,” both co-authored with literacy experts Meredith and David Liben. She holds a bachelor’s degree in early childhood education and a law degree from Cornell University.

Meet our host, Susan Lambert

Susan Lambert is the Chief Academic Officer of Elementary Humanities at Amplify, and the host of Science of Reading: The Podcast. Throughout her career, she has focused on creating high-quality learning environments using evidence-based practices. Lambert is a mom of four, a grandma of four, a world traveler, and a collector of stories.

As the host of Science of Reading: The Podcast, Lambert explores the increasing body of scientific research around how reading is best taught. As a former classroom teacher, administrator, and curriculum developer, Lambert is dedicated to turning theory into best practices that educators can put right to use in the classroom, and to showcasing national models of reading instruction excellence.

Quotes

“Vocabulary is how we describe concepts. It's how we know how to talk to one another. And vocabulary development weaves its way through all four domains in the standards. All four—reading, writing, listening and speaking, and language.” —Sue Pimentel
“What the standards say is, ‘Leveled texts are out and complex texts are in.’ There's no research behind assigning a level to students' reading and then sort of imprisoning them in that.” —Sue Pimentel
“Text complexity level is critical for students to be able to do well when they leave school and also so they can independently read texts and other sorts of sources on their own as well.” —Sue Pimentel
“So standards are really important, right? Because they allow a meeting of the minds in terms of this is what our students need to be learning. It's like a compact, if you will, with our students and our parents and the public to say, ‘This is what you can expect your students to be learning.’” —Sue Pimentel
“The standards define the 'what' importantly...the level of complexity, the level of sophistication. Really, really important. But curriculum tells us how to do the 'what' well, and to use the literacy research to make sure all students get access.” —Sue Pimentel
“The more stuff you know, the better you're able to navigate the world. Whether that means as a citizen…as a worker…as a college student…as a mom or dad—whatever it is—the more you know about stuff, the better off and I think the happier life is. And certainly the happier kids' lives are when they're actually learning stuff.” —Sue Pimentel
“The whole notion is that the content matters. What I'm reading about matters; and how I get through that content matters; and how I get access to that content matters—which means I'm building my knowledge slowly but surely.” —Sue Pimentel